The Silent Majority - Million of Pro Spanish Catalans protests on the streets

Myles O'Reilly

Donator
Premium Account
Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2017
Messages
4,827
Likes
3,995
Points
263
Location
Ireland
#26
Nobody could suggest that the Basque Country is a natural part of Spain. For that reason alone you'd have to accept that Spain is an artificial state - just like the so called "UK."
I would disagree Tadgh. The UK is a union of two nations who go back over a millennia. The Basque region was never a nation in its own right. Spain is definitely not artificial.
 

Tadhg Gaelach

Donator
Premium Account
Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2016
Messages
26,197
Likes
23,751
Points
313
#27
I would disagree Tadgh. The UK is a union of two nations who go back over a millennia. The Basque region was never a nation in its own right. Spain is definitely not artificial.

Of course it was. In fact, the Basque Country was the only place in what is now "Spain" to stop the Muslim invasion. They fought so well, that the Muslims left them alone and went on to invade France.

As for the "UK" it is a supposed union of four states - actually three states violently invaded by one state.
 

Tadhg Gaelach

Donator
Premium Account
Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2016
Messages
26,197
Likes
23,751
Points
313
#29
Ach how long ago was that Tadgh

The point is that it has been a distinct nation for a very long time. As I say, they speak the oldest language in Europe - which was in Europe before the Indo-European invasions. If anybody in Europe deserves to be independent - it's the Basques.
 
Joined
Jul 31, 2017
Messages
1,064
Likes
1,521
Points
163
#30
I found this book to be a good The Basque History of the World: The Story of a Nation by Mark Kurlansky if anyone was interested on the Basques.
Basque and Navarre is still apart of Spain and the basque language spans both Spain and France, so France does not want any of this happening as well, its whole south region is in danger of similar calls for independence. And with all the muslims in the place, how long before an independent caliphate of Paris starts kicking off. Balkanisation of Europe ?


Anyway, no one putting much out of these politicians leading these people off a cliff, so ill dump this here, what i could find.

Here's a general take an ethnic/nationalist catalan
Catalan supremacism - Wikipedia


This nationalism is being pushed by parties like Republican Left of Catalonia - Wikipedia ERC
It had Heribert Barrera - Wikipedia leading it.
Google Tradutor Heribert Barrera: "If Catalonia has to go well, Spain has to go bad, go bad"
'IMMIGRATION
If the current migratory flows continue, Catalonia will disappear," says the octogenarian political leader, who acknowledges that "if I knew that blacks and Maghreb would speak all Catalan, immigration would seem less problematic, but I would not think it would benefit us at all. I do not pretend that a country should have a pure breed, but there is a genetic distribution in the Catalan population that is statistically different from that of the sub-Saharan population. There are many characteristics of the person that come genetically determined and intelligence is a ...
RACISM
Barrera warns that today everything is labeled a racist, and racism is only considering one race superior to another. "When Haider says that in Austria there are too many foreigners he does not make any racist proclamations. It means that he wants to preserve Austrian society just as he likes. " However, he considers blacks less intelligent: "the IQ of blacks in the United States is inferior to that of whites" and does not make him disgusted by the sterilization of "a mentally weak because of a genetic factor." '

Now ERC is lead by Oriol Junqueras - Wikipedia This guy is vice president of Catalan, from Catalan supremacism - Wikipedia
'In 2008, Oriol Junqueras, the leader of Catalonia's main pro-independence left-wing party Esquerra Republicana de Catalunya since 2011, published an article in the Catalan newspaper Avui in which he made the following statements regarding population genetics:
...Catalans have a closer genetic proximity to the French than to the Spaniards; more with the Italians than with the Portuguese, and a little with the Swiss. Meanwhile Spaniards have a lot of proximity with the Portuguese and very little with the French. Strange..." - [41]'

He helped set up Junts pel Sí - Wikipedia
"coalition which won 62 seats in the 135-member Parliament of Catalonia"


The biggest party in the coalition is Catalan European Democratic Party - Wikipedia PDeCAT which has that weird looking chap you see on tv Carles Puigdemont - Wikipedia as leader and hes president.
More of an all encompasing pro liberal pro catalan pro europe party.


But the coalition also includes more ERC like parties like Democratic Convergence of Catalonia - Wikipedia CDC led by this guy, Artur Mas - Wikipedia who was president and has an interesting background
"Juan Mas Roig, great-great-grandfather of the former president of the Generalitat Artur Mas, was a slave ship captain who in 1844 moved 825 slaves from Africa to Brazil.[11]"

And he thinks catalans are less spanish and more german, from Catalan supremacism - Wikipedia
'In 2012 Artur Mas, President of the Catalan government between 2010 and 2016 and leader of Democratic Convergence of Catalonia published an article in La Vanguardia explaining his views on the relationship between Catalonia and other regions of Spain.
Catalonia, twelve centuries ago, belonged to the Marca Hispanica and the capital was Aachen, the heart of the Carolingian Empire. Something must remain in our DNA, because the Catalans we have an umbilical cord which makes us more Germanic and less Roman..
— Artur Mas, Interview in La Vanguardia, 2012 [42]'

He's no fool, he knows which poles to grease, President Mas: "Israel is a strategic country for Catalonia and we wa… and who inspires him “It is wonderful Israel can be a source of inspiration for Catalonia’”, Alon Bar, Ambassador (Israel) | Reagrupament International

CDC used to be run by this guy Jordi Pujol - Wikipedia, total crook


Either way a very anti spanish, somewhat pro ethnic german/italian/catalan ?, pro EU coalition, but if the EU bid fails they can allways try to be a tax haven and get more foreign investment
 
Last edited:
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
2,197
Likes
902
Points
163
Location
Ireland
#31
'In 2008, Oriol Junqueras, the leader of Catalonia's main pro-independence left-wing party Esquerra Republicana de Catalunya since 2011, published an article in the Catalan newspaper Avui in which he made the following statements regarding population genetics:

...Catalans have a closer genetic proximity to the French than to the Spaniards; more with the Italians than with the Portuguese, and a little with the Swiss. Meanwhile Spaniards have a lot of proximity with the Portuguese and very little with the French. Strange..." - [41]'
The Popular Front 4 the Liberation of Greater Catalonia supports the return of Alghero to the Democratic Republic of Catalonia - This is why..

'In English, the term referring to a person first appears in the mid 14th century as Catelaner, followed in the 15th century as Catellain (from French).

During much of its history, and especially during the Francoist dictatorship (1939–1975), the Catalan language has often been degraded as a mere dialect of Spanish. This view, based on political and ideological considerations, has no linguistic validity. Spanish and Catalan have important differences in their sound systems, lexicon, and grammatical features, placing the language in a number of respects closer to Occitan (and French).'

Northern Catalonia with respect to Catalonia, Spain (left); Northern Catalonia within France (right).



The Crown of Aragon in 1443.


Catalan - It is the only official language of Andorra, and a co-official language of the Spanish autonomous communities of Catalonia, the Balearic Islands and Valencia (where the language is known as Valencian). It also has semi-official status in the Italian commune of Alghero. These territories are often called Catalan Countries.

Following the French capture of Algeria (1833), that region saw several waves of Catalan-speaking settlers. People from the Spanish Alacant province settled around Oran, whereas Algiers received immigration from Northern Catalonia and Menorca. Their speech was known as patuet. By 1911, the number of Catalan speakers was around 100,000. After the declaration of independence of Algeria in 1962, almost all the Catalan speakers fled to Northern Catalonia (as Pieds-Noirs) or Alacant.

Nowadays, France recognizes only French as an official language. Nevertheless, on 10 December 2007, the General Council of the Pyrénées-Orientales officially recognized Catalan as one of the languages of the department and seeks to further promote it in public life and education.

The number of Pieds-Noirs who fled Algeria totalled more than 800,000 between 1962 and 1964.

The French administration avoided acknowledging the true numbers of refugees in order to avoid upsetting its Algeria policies. Consequently, few plans were made for their return, and, psychologically at least, many of the Pieds-Noirs were alienated from both Algeria and France.

Many Pieds-Noirs settled in continental France, while others migrated to New Caledonia, Australia, Spain, Israel, Italy, the United States, Canada and Argentina.



Catalan is still spoken in Sardinia, (Alghero), and is one of the four languages spoken by the Pieds-Noirs, alongside French, Occitan and Spanish.
 
Joined
Jul 31, 2017
Messages
1,064
Likes
1,521
Points
163
#32
The Popular Front 4 the Liberation of Greater Catalonia supports the return of Alghero to the Democratic Republic of Catalonia - This is why..
'In English, the term referring to a person first appears in the mid 14th century as Catelaner, followed in the 15th century as Catellain (from French).
.....
Catalan is still spoken in Sardinia, (Alghero), and is one of the four languages spoken by the Pieds-Noirs, alongside French, Occitan and Spanish.
Thanks, I get the claim on east coastal spain and a bit of france by one group.

But you have others in the coalition talking about "us more Germanic and less Roman" and the Marca Hispanica - Wikipedia, they are all over the place.
 
Joined
Mar 23, 2016
Messages
1,860
Likes
964
Points
113
#33
The trouble is we don't know who the so called silent majority are,because the Madrid government didn't have the gumption to let the Catalonians have a referendum.I'm sure they must be regretting this now.By the way calling the noisy Spanish unionists silent is most definitely inaccurate.Let's remember greedy gravy train EU politicians don't want real democracy,they are seeing their precious EU collapsing and it's breaking their hearts.
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
Messages
501
Likes
336
Points
63
Location
Kerry
#36
I’m the same. I’m not sure what to make of it all.
Most of the posters on the other site who’s opinion I follow haven’t made up their mind yet either so I can’t say which side I am on yet either . Personally I can’t see the big deal in deciding for one or the other I wish they would get with deciding as people are asking me what I think and I look stupid not knowing what is the right answer .
 
Top Bottom