If your child was gay...

Tadhg Gaelach

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Perhaps you're interpreting it through an Abrahamic lens?

In any case, a lot of the sexual exhibitionism, even among heterosexuals, is a reaction to a pathological sexual repression that traces its genealogy to the Middle east.

Yes, it's remarkable if you go to Asia you will never see any public demonstrations of sexual affection (except for a few Westernized loonies).
 
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But the heathen Germanic tribes practiced very extreme censure of homosexuality. Tacticus talks about this in "Germania".
Revolt of the Batavi - Wikipedia
Vitellius' governor in Germania Inferior, desperate to raise more troops, lost the goodwill of the Batavi by attempting to conscript more Batavi than the maximum stipulated in their treaty.
The brutality and corruption of the Roman recruiting-centurions, who were also responsible for many cases of sexual assault on Batavi boys, brought already deep discontent in the Batavi homeland to the boil.[10]
Tacitus Historiae IV.14
The Histories (Tacitus)/Book 4 - Wikisource, the free online library
Civilis, who was resolved on rebellion, and intended, while concealing his ulterior designs, to reveal his other plans as occasion presented itself, set about the work of revolution in this way. By command of Vitellius all the Batavian youth was then being summoned to the conscription, a thing naturally vexatious, and which the officials made yet more burdensome by their rapacity and profligacy, while they selected aged and infirm persons, whom they might discharge for a consideration, and mere striplings, but of distinguished beauty (and many attain even in boyhood to a noble stature), whom they dragged off for infamous purposes. This caused indignation, and the ringleaders of the concerted rebellion prevailed upon the people to refuse the conscription. Civilis collected at one of the sacred groves, ostensibly for a banquet, the chiefs of the nation and the boldest spirits of the lower class. When he saw them warmed with the festivities of the night, he began by speaking of the renown and glory of their race, and then counted the wrongs and the oppressions which they endured, and all the other evils of slavery.
At the very least they despised the pederasty Pederasty - Wikipedia of the romans and their treatment of their conscripted boys.
This was the last straw for them as far as Tacitus was concerned and so they revolted. So yes i would consider the gay agenda an issue for at least this germanic tribe, as age of consent wasnt as much an issue back then that it is now, but the mass buggery of their youth by the romans was.
 

SwordOfStCatherine

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Here's an interesting blog post on the matter.

Germanic Belief: Homosexuality

"It seems more likely to me that what Tacitus meant by “disgraceful sexual acts” was child molestation … which I believe triggered the same revulsion in the elder as it does in us today; complete with a differentiation between the worst types of felons and the child molester. And especially considering how much the Germanic peoples interacted with Greece and Rome; where homosexuality was more or less (respectively) permissible. And especially among a culture that didn’t stray too far into what goes on behind closed doors, ie. in the private sphere; such that it even a thrall was, by social custom or thew, afforded lordship under his own roof. "
I asked someone who knows their Latin about this and they confirmed that yes he was referring to homosexuality and not child abuse as such. My immense revulsion at the idea of cremation is most certainly Abrahamic- and I do find the idea of cremation more revolting than I consenting homosexual activity between adults- however I am not sure that my attitudes on this subject particularly are at all given that historically it was also very much taboo during most of China's and India's history. I have had people both English Anglicans and Irish Catholics attempt to argue with me that despite what he clearly writes in his undisputed Epistles that St Paul really didn't share typical Second Temple Jewish attitudes towards both homosexuality and effeminacy using all sorts of Jesuitical spinning- I suspect that your friends are doing something similar with Tacticus. Also the attitude towards homosexuality wasn't at all places and at all times one of tolerance in the Hellenic and Roman worlds.

https://altright.com/2017/09/26/the-alt-right-and-the-homosexual-question-part-2/

"Hostility and aversion to the ‘recruiting’ or pederastic elements of homosexuality were commonplace in Imperial Rome. We know from Polybius that the Roman army punished homosexual relations between soldiers with death, and from Valerius Maximus that the upper echelons of the armies of the middle and late Republic were forced to confront incidents where homosexual officers had been sexually molesting young subordinates. Indeed, Tacitus remarks that one of the main reasons for the revolt of the Batavians, a Germanic tribe on the Rhine, against the Romans was the conscription, and subsequent molestation, of their youths in the Roman army. Whatever tolerance was shown to such behavior by Imperial authorities, it appears to have increased along with the decline of the Empire.

The link between the toleration of homosexual behavior and civilizational decline is an interesting one. Although both Parmenides and Aristotle argued that heredity played a large role in the homosexuality of the Greeks, and more especially the Dorians, Havelock Ellis, the early ‘sexologist,’ argued that the prevalence of what he called “sexual inversion” in Greek society was rooted more in the human “herd instinct” and was due more to a “state of social feeling that however it originated, induced a large proportion of the ordinary population to adopt homosexuality as a fashion.” Once a society adopted this fashion, it contributed to the “demoralizing of the manhood of a nation,” and was a sign of impending national or civilizational collapse into decadence and despondency. The goal was thus to avoid a situation in which homosexual ‘recruitment’ was “normalized” and, more crucially, to prevent the behaviors associated with these psychological disorders from becoming fashionable. This connection between homosexual behavior and civilizational decline is simply too large in scope to properly deal with here, but it should remain a background note to our consideration of the issue as a whole. More specifically, it is necessary to give some consideration to Ellis’ theory that homosexuality became ‘fashionable’ in Ancient Greece. By what means?

As both a contemporary and historical phenomenon, it is difficult to separate homosexual behavior from pederasty, so reliant has the former been upon the latter. The introduction of the legal decree Lex Scantina by the Romans around 149 B.C. appears to have been a reaction to the rape and sexual abuse of young male citizens, and a number of prosecutions against Senators and other Roman elites are documented. The pederastic preference among homosexuals appears to have survived the last two millennia but is currently inhibited from full ‘expression’ by legal, social, and cultural obstacles. For example, in one 2000 study of sexual age preferences by orientation, psychologists found that homosexuals were on average most likely to select the youngest possible option: a teenage boy. By contrast, sexually normal males were most likely to select a 25-year-old female.4 It is highly controversial to suggest that homosexuals may be more likely to sexually abuse children, and due to a lack of reliable studies, such an argument is not advanced here. However, there are very credible studies indicating that child sexual abuse plays a role in the development of homosexuality — a form of ‘recruitment,’ for lack of a better term. For example, a 2001 study in Archives of Sexual Behavior found that “gay men and lesbian women reported a significantly higher rate of childhood molestation than did heterosexual men and women. Forty-six percent of the homosexual men in contrast to 7% of the heterosexual men reported homosexual molestation. Twenty-two percent of lesbian women in contrast to 1% of heterosexual women reported homosexual molestation.”5"
 
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Yes, it's remarkable if you go to Asia you will never see any public demonstrations of sexual affection (except for a few Westernized loonies).
I visited Damascus a few times in the late 70's and was surprised to see males holding hands in public - including soldiers in uniform.

I don't think it was sexual at all but it was something you wouldn't see in the west at that time.
 
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I asked someone who knows their Latin about this and they confirmed that yes he was referring to homosexuality and not child abuse as such. My immense revulsion at the idea of cremation is most certainly Abrahamic-
I'm a fan of sky burials mesmelf.

But finding the vultures might be a bit of a challenge.
Since we lack the feathered kind , I'll probably have to make do with the pinstriped kind -- unless I die wealthy enough to have my corpse dispatched to Nepal Pompus



https://altright.com/2017/09/26/the-alt-right-and-the-homosexual-question-part-2/

"Hostility and aversion to the ‘recruiting’ or pederastic elements of homosexuality were commonplace in Imperial Rome. We know from Polybius that the Roman army punished homosexual relations between soldiers with death, and from Valerius Maximus that the upper echelons of the armies of the middle and late Republic were forced to confront incidents where homosexual officers had been sexually molesting young subordinates. Indeed, Tacitus remarks that one of the main reasons for the revolt of the Batavians, a Germanic tribe on the Rhine, against the Romans was the conscription, and subsequent molestation, of their youths in the Roman army. Whatever tolerance was shown to such behavior by Imperial authorities, it appears to have increased along with the decline of the Empire.

The link between the toleration of homosexual behavior and civilizational decline is an interesting one. Although both Parmenides and Aristotle argued that heredity played a large role in the homosexuality of the Greeks, and more especially the Dorians, Havelock Ellis, the early ‘sexologist,’ argued that the prevalence of what he called “sexual inversion” in Greek society was rooted more in the human “herd instinct” and was due more to a “state of social feeling that however it originated, induced a large proportion of the ordinary population to adopt homosexuality as a fashion.” Once a society adopted this fashion, it contributed to the “demoralizing of the manhood of a nation,” and was a sign of impending national or civilizational collapse into decadence and despondency. The goal was thus to avoid a situation in which homosexual ‘recruitment’ was “normalized” and, more crucially, to prevent the behaviors associated with these psychological disorders from becoming fashionable. This connection between homosexual behavior and civilizational decline is simply too large in scope to properly deal with here, but it should remain a background note to our consideration of the issue as a whole. More specifically, it is necessary to give some consideration to Ellis’ theory that homosexuality became ‘fashionable’ in Ancient Greece. By what means?

As both a contemporary and historical phenomenon, it is difficult to separate homosexual behavior from pederasty, so reliant has the former been upon the latter. The introduction of the legal decree Lex Scantina by the Romans around 149 B.C. appears to have been a reaction to the rape and sexual abuse of young male citizens, and a number of prosecutions against Senators and other Roman elites are documented. The pederastic preference among homosexuals appears to have survived the last two millennia but is currently inhibited from full ‘expression’ by legal, social, and cultural obstacles. For example, in one 2000 study of sexual age preferences by orientation, psychologists found that homosexuals were on average most likely to select the youngest possible option: a teenage boy. By contrast, sexually normal males were most likely to select a 25-year-old female.4 It is highly controversial to suggest that homosexuals may be more likely to sexually abuse children, and due to a lack of reliable studies, such an argument is not advanced here. However, there are very credible studies indicating that child sexual abuse plays a role in the development of homosexuality — a form of ‘recruitment,’ for lack of a better term. For example, a 2001 study in Archives of Sexual Behavior found that “gay men and lesbian women reported a significantly higher rate of childhood molestation than did heterosexual men and women. Forty-six percent of the homosexual men in contrast to 7% of the heterosexual men reported homosexual molestation. Twenty-two percent of lesbian women in contrast to 1% of heterosexual women reported homosexual molestation.”5"
LOLlllllllllllll

Altright. com?
Andrew Joyce?

"And now for a fair and balanced analysis of Pagan attitudes towards homosexuality , could you please welcome Mr Anjem Choudary"

I notice the only source he references (for the historical bit of his diatribe) is a text on Anglo-Saxon burial practices.
He also leaves out Tacitus' description of homosexuality among the Celtic tribes in Gaul.
Her also leaves out the references by later, early Christian era Roman historians describing homosexuality among the southern Germanic tribes.

As for the Lex Scantina, it prohibits "passive homosexuality" for free men; he fails to provide sources to back up his claims about prosecutions.
Still, it was a very tame law in comparison to the Christian era decrees that punished homosexuality with burning at the stake.

No one is claiming that leather and gimp mask clad, BDSM simulating homosexuals paraded through the town centres of pre Christian Europe.
But we can discern that it was, overall, relatively more tolerant than the Christian era of such individuals.
 
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I visited Damascus a few times in the late 70's and was surprised to see males holding hands in public - including soldiers in uniform.

I don't think it was sexual at all but it was something you wouldn't see in the west at that time.
You find this anywhere in a society where males have enforced a domineering society. The males for lack of real intimate emotional relationship with a female human who provides the compliment and opposite of his own male energy and is good for both males and females on every level -- resorts to looking for and finding emotional relationships with other men

- they male "partnerings" become quite "bitchy" as the term is used here in the west - quite jealous of other males who muster in on their "special" pal/friend - we have it among certain groups of males here too in the West, you get it in some working class males - probably in some d4 class types too, espcially with emotionally retarded Irish males who use following sports as a crutch for male companship, and nearly whose real partnership is with other "lads" in the pub rather than their real female partner at home with the kids, or just at home.
Your first and true partner is your gf or wife, all others come after her and your kids.

It is good for men and women to be able to relate to each other on every level and find something of the other gender and energy that cannot be provided by ones own gender. It is suffocating and boring to try to find all that amongst ones own gender.
Hence why a male and female are also the best and most healthy for children, not homosexuals. It is in childs best interest to have a natural male and female Mother and father energy in their lives.
 
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By normal he means normal for our civilization in terms of not just space but also time. You ancestors should be ashamed of you.
Is our time better or worse?
100 years ago you could be deported or hung for stealing. Abortion was not even a question, you had them in some back room, they happened, but we don't like, or discuss, such events.. Gay was unheard of, though same sex shagging also happened regularly.. Have we changed?
 
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If your Child was Gay....
I must say, as a young straight person looking on at the debate, I am astounded at the vitriol being unleashed on the gay community from not only society but on this website too.​
It seems that those who spout homophobic rhetoric are the ones most obsessed by the topic.​
I simply live by the motto, live and let live.​
It led me to asking myself, if I have a gay child in the future, what would I do?​
For a start, I would wish them the very best in life and would do my best to ensure they have the equality of opportunity every child deserves.​
But...the scary thing is, given the average number of gay people, (what is it, 5%?) there are going to be many homophobic posters here and in society at large having gay children.​
One wonders what they would do in that instance. Would they disown their child simply because they have not fulfilled their normative wishes for them, or would they suddenly get a change of heart?​
I am interested in whether any of you have had gay children or for gay posters, what the experience for you was like.​
At least, crowds like the Iona Institute will die out by the time Generation Y comes into a position of influence.​
I personally don't believe anyone is GAY or Straight!
I believe we develop sexual preferences as we grow.
We choose to define ourselves by our sexual likes, or dislikes, but I don't believe we should.
Many "GAY" people have lived very straight lives for many years...
And likewise many "STRAIGHT" people have also lived Gay lives...
At what point do you become Gay or Straight?
 

Helen Back

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You find this anywhere in a society where males have enforced a domineering society. The males for lack of real intimate emotional relationship with a female human who provides the compliment and opposite of his own male energy and is good for both males and females on every level -- resorts to looking for and finding emotional relationships with other men

- they male "partnerings" become quite "bitchy" as the term is used here in the west - quite jealous of other males who muster in on their "special" pal/friend - we have it among certain groups of males here too in the West, you get it in some working class males - probably in some d4 class types too, espcially with emotionally retarded Irish males who use following sports as a crutch for male companship, and nearly whose real partnership is with other "lads" in the pub rather than their real female partner at home with the kids, or just at home.
Your first and true partner is your gf or wife, all others come after her and your kids.

It is good for men and women to be able to relate to each other on every level and find something of the other gender and energy that cannot be provided by ones own gender. It is suffocating and boring to try to find all that amongst ones own gender.
Hence why a male and female are also the best and most healthy for children, not homosexuals. It is in childs best interest to have a natural male and female Mother and father energy in their lives.
It's not homophobic when straight people to find it difficult to understand same-sex attraction.
It's hard to describe but it just seems there's something very inward-looking and deeply narcissistic about it--like trying to find a version of oneself rather than the unknown and unknowable opposite sex, which is where the mystery lies, and being open to the risks it entails, and making that relationship work.
 
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It's not homophobic when straight people to find it difficult to understand same-sex attraction.
It's hard to describe but it just seems there's something very inward-looking and deeply narcissistic about it--like trying to find a version of oneself rather than the unknown and unknowable opposite sex, which is where the mystery lies, and being open to the risks it entails, and making that relationship work.
I believe consenting adults should be allowed have (whatever) sex with whoever they want. Gay/Straight/Bisexual are just labels we chose to use!
 

Helen Back

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I believe consenting adults should be allowed have (whatever) sex with whoever they want. Gay/Straight/Bisexual are just labels we chose to use!
So do I--people are what they are, it doesn't bother me in the least what they sexually (as long as men who are married to women don't have illicit gay sex and put their wives at risk) and I support legal protection for long-term gay relationships.

But homosexual unions aren't marriage though, and never can be; marriage is between a man and a woman.
 
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