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21‭ ‬November 1920: 100 years ago today -Bloody Sunday.

Catalpa

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21‭ ‬November 1920: Bloody Sunday. IRA units organised around Michael Collins hit team ‘the Squad’ raided the premises of British spies and agents across Dublin City. The plan was to kill up to 35 men on the day. The core of this group were the notorious ‘Cairo Gang’ brought into Ireland specifically to gather information on IRA members in the City. Most of the ones on the hit list who were caught unawares did not escape. Others were more fortunate and made their escape just in time. In the event 14 people were killed incl at least one entirely innocent female victim. The IRA lost just one man captured. Nearly all of the raids were carried out in a small area of Dublin in the centre of the City.

The events of that morning rocked Britain’s spy network in the Capital to the core and in effect destroyed it as a viable espionage force.‭ Michael Collins justified what by necessity assassins’ work with the words:

My one intention was the destruction of the undesirables who continued to make miserable the lives of ordinary decent citizens.‭ I have proof enough to assure myself of the atrocities which this gang of spies and informers have committed. If I had a second motive it was no more than a feeling such as I would have for a dangerous reptile. By their destruction the very air is made sweeter… For myself, my conscience is clear. There is no crime in detecting in wartime the spy and the informer. They have destroyed without trial. I have paid them back in their own coin.

That afternoon the Crown Forces raided Croke Park where Dublin were playing Tipperary and proceeded to open fire on the teams and spectators,‭ killing 14 innocent people (including two young boys and a 26-year-old woman). One of the dead was Michael Hogan who was playing for Tipperary that day.

Controversy as to who fired first was immediate with the Crown Forces insisting they were shot at before returning fire. However the most likely explanation is that members of the Auxiliary Division of the RIC fired warning shots in the air to panic the crowd and other members out of sight took it upon themselves to open up under the impression that IRA men in the crowd had targeted them.

A DMP Constable recounted to the Official Inquiry held in December 1920 by the British Military that:

‘On Sunday 21st inst. I was on duty outside the main entrance to Croke Park in Jones’s Road. At about 3.25 p.m. I saw six or seven large lorries accompanied by two armoured cars, one in front and one behind, pass along the Clonliffe Road from Drumcondra towards Ballybough. Immediately after a small armoured car came across Jones’s Road from Fitzroy Avenue and pulled up at the entrance of the main gate. Immediately after that, three small Crossley lorries pulled up in Jones’s Road. There were about ten or twelve men dressed in RIC uniforms in each. When they got out of the cars they started firing in the air which I thought was blank ammunition, and almost immediately firing started all round the ground.’

That night two senior members of the Dublin IRA,‭ Dick McKee and Peadar Clancy and a hapless civilian, Conor Clune, all of whom had been captured the previous day were done to death inside Dublin Castle ostensibly while ‘attempting to escape’.
 
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El Chaval.

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Did the Brits ever give some rationale or public explanation of this?
Did they claim for example that "they came under fire" etc? Anything?
Also, the only British M.P to condemn the Black and Tans actions in Ireland, in the House of Commons was the leader of the BUF, Oswald Mosley.
 

TW Tone

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Kevin Myers on Newstalk yesterday said that the IRA Batallion on the North side (I think it was the 4th, Kevin Barry's old outfit) refused to get involved in the morning's activities.
I never heard that before, wonder what's his source.
 
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Catalpa

Catalpa

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Kevin Myers on Newstalk yesterday said that the IRA Batallion on the North side (I think it was the 4th, Kevin Barry's old outfit) refused to get involved in the morning's activities.
I never heard that before, wonder what's his source.
I don't know but maybe they were not asked?

I think 'the Squad' was a close knit group the whole aim being to maintain operational secrecy.
 
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The establishment must know they are in trouble, trying to reclaim our patriot dead again on rte2. I bet you there won't be any diversity on display tonight, they have overplayed their hand and they know it.
 

TW Tone

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I don't know but maybe they were not asked?

I think 'the Squad' was a close knit group the whole aim being to maintain operational secrecy.
Two other relevant possibilities.
First, the initial target list had been much bigger. It was cut back severely, I think at Cathal Brugha's insistence.
Second, quite a few of the assassination units drew blanks--couldnt locate their targets.
Would be easy in those cases to claim they didn't fancy shooting men in their pyjamas.
 
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Catalpa

Catalpa

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Two other relevant possibilities.
First, the initial target list had been much bigger. It was cut back severely, I think at Cathal Brugha's insistence.
Second, quite a few of the assassination units drew blanks--couldnt locate their targets.
Would be easy in those cases to claim they didn't fancy shooting men in their pyjamas.
Held a Mauser in my hand a few years ago that was 'out' on Bloody Sunday'

- but it misfired on the day! o_O
 

Anglophile

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At least part of Collins' cowardly murder gang mixed in with the crowd at the match.

There were IRA men in both teams.

Inconvenient truths which will be lost in a one-sided, sacred cow, mythological commemoration.:rolleyes:
 

Major Infraction

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At least part of Collins' cowardly murder gang mixed in with the crowd at the match.

There were IRA men in both teams.

Inconvenient truths which will be lost in a one-sided, sacred cow, mythological commemoration.:rolleyes:

And even if that’s true, you seem to be justifying the indiscriminate slaughter of unarmed civilians.

Oh wait. I’ve just noticed your username.

You lot have had no issue with that at any stage.

And sure don’t you also have the monopoly on one-sides mythological commemorations?

Ya nasty C U N T.
 
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